Pantagraph.com | News | Police investigate apparent robbery at Windjammer Lounge

Note: All views and opinions expressed in reader comments are solely those of the individual submitting the comment, and not those of the Pantagraph or its staff.

alexp wrote on Sep 30, 2008 8:33 PM:

" To MISS perhaps not very bright robbers? Certainly seems like it.

To 8271 get out there with your gun and start the vigilanti movement!

As for the Arbors? Perhaps it can find the same fate as the Coachman (just on a quicker schedule). "

4mama wrote on Sep 30, 2008 5:51 PM:

" Everybody who thinks we can be responsible for our "own race" just cracks me up. Like any of us is a pedigree or something. I thought America was a big melting pot! I have a child of a different race than I am. Should I just let her run wild and then blame others of the same race for her misbehavior? How about some accountability for our own actions, and for disciplining our kids, and even for saying something to people we know who are not on the right track. "

Constitution Wanker wrote on Sep 30, 2008 3:47 PM:

" While I like the idea of a police substation in the area, but I have a feeling that it will likely go unmanned much of the time similar to the Normal PD substation on Orlando... "

dano7467 wrote on Sep 30, 2008 3:13 PM:

" I would like to see anyone try to do better...... ya ok lets turn around and give a good stare down to the crazed dudes with the guns...... i dont think so. I also agree that something needs to be done about this area. The surrouding area is a great place to live except for the arbors... this one apartment complex is a haven for thugs in what otherwise is a great part of town! As you probably read in other posts, this definitely wasnt the first nor the last robbery of this type that has happend recently in this area and all trails lead back to the arbors. public outcry is needed to make this area safe again for good people in the area who actually work for a living. its time to take this neighborhood back! my heart goes out to the rest of the patrons of the windjammer that had to go through this incident and thank god nothing more happend. "

dano7467 wrote on Sep 30, 2008 3:13 PM:

" Ok...... I was at the windjammer when this happend. We gave the best description we could alright. They ran in from the back door to the beer garden and we all had our heads turned watching the bears game. They were three black males, in my best guess i would say in their 20's. They had their hoodies tied fairly tight around their heads and ran in yelling at us to get the F*@k down. I got told to stop looking and then jacked in the back of the head for just turning to grab my girlfriend. once the shot was fired everyone was below bar level. This is exactly what we all told the police so they do have the best possible description that we could give. "

yaitsme wrote on Sep 30, 2008 11:52 AM:

" mikeman, you would do better to form a neighborhood watch group then to depend on the city council to do ANYTHING at all! jipsi i couldn't agree with you more. A DETAILED description is not too much to ask for. Racism has NOTHING to do with the desire for a detailed description!!! It gives the public a sporting chance to avoid these thugs(No matter WHAT race they are) and keep their family safe. As it is we( the citizens of B/N) are clueless as to who these thugs may be and gives them the advantage of anonymity, should they decide to perpetrate this kind of crime again!! "

OGS wrote on Sep 30, 2008 9:46 AM:

" Concealed carry would stop a lot of this type of crime! "

jipsi wrote on Sep 30, 2008 9:21 AM:

" Today's update (09/30) mentions the investigation is hampered by lack of a better description of suspects.
Hooded sweatshirts, and dressed in black. But were their FACES covered? Their hands? Was their HEIGHT undeterminable?
If the FACES were visible, then a skin-color CAN be determined: light complexion? Dark? Asian-looking?
If the perps had GREEN HANDS and GREEN FACES, and two were TALL and one was SHORT and FAT, then there's NO REASON that information cannot be shared to the public!

Say three guys come into a convenience store, hands in pockets and muttering to each other (suspicious already, right? dont call 'em in yet, as ALL teens to 20-somethings act THAT way on occasion); they're 20-ish, all dressed in black and hoodies pulled up (okay, now your finger is itching to pick up the phone; DO, but wait...), and - BAM! - their skin is GREEN! A manager or customer would COMPLETELY be justified in calling the cops to check things out... RIGHT?
This will NOT happen, however, if better descriptions, ANY helpful information, is not given to the PUBLIC while suspects are AT LARGE, and potentially capable of pulling another similar crime.... "

MISSterious wrote on Sep 30, 2008 9:13 AM:

" Why would robbers think that there would be very much cash in the drawer relatively early in the evening at a bar? and on a Sunday? "

8271 wrote on Sep 30, 2008 8:38 AM:

" Black, White, Hispanic etc etc. How about this, we all start holding our own races responsible for good behavior and take responsibility for our communities. It all starts at home and in our own neighborhoods. Stand up against these thugs and take your life and neighborhoods back, run the thugs and drug dealers the heck out of this town so we can be proud of this town now and into the future. "

sellingaz wrote on Sep 30, 2008 3:31 AM:

" It amazes me that this article has sparked any racial issues. I agree with Pupnda! Let the Police do their job, and Find the people who did this. Can you all tell me, if you had a gun pointed at you, shots were fired, and people were in danger, you would be able to get a good description?! Maybe the police haven't released descriptions for a reason. In the meantime, I am very thankful that everyone is okay! That's what we should be focusing on!
It was a freak thing, and a terrible thing. However, there is no reason to start pointing fingers and calling out people based upon their race! Give me a break! There is also no reason, to call the area unsafe! How many places have gotten robbed in the past couple of years? Or days, for that matter? Don't try to scare people. There are alot of good people at the jammer, and there hasn't been any serious issues there in years! Personally, I'd be more scared to go to the bank, than to the Windjammer! Again, thank goodness that everyone is okay! "

jipsi wrote on Sep 30, 2008 12:10 AM:

" Thank you, Woo, for the support. You GET IT!

I'm FIRM (in faith and values) but the most open-minded, 'take a walk in someone else's moccasins' person anyone could ever hope to meet. My blood fairly rushes with a desire for EQUALITY and FAIRNESS in all things. It's the lop-sided, hypocritical reverse racism that gets ME riled. If the alleged perps are WHITE, then allow citizens to STOP looking askance at EVERY non-white, mis-guessing the race of those 'who done it'. Whether a description is given or not, citizens will wonder, suppose, even WAGER, on the subject, and THAT is far more dangerous than a current manhunt for three or four white twenty-somethings (or black or Asian or Latino twenty-somethings, etc.)!

I should refrain from mentioning you might want to turn your CAPS OFF in your posts...LOL.
Just kidding. It WOULD make it a little easier to read, and I mean that in the friendliest way. I'm probably the WORST person here to offer advice in punctuation and grammar, as I've been dumped on many-a-time for MY use of caps (in place of bold for emphasis)... :-)
Thanks again for the words of support...

jip "

jipsi wrote on Sep 29, 2008 11:49 PM:

" to Inaperfectworld:
I'm in B-N three to five times a week. My living 15 to 20 minutes outside of B-N for SAFETY doesn't mean I'm still not involved and concerned with "my town"... I got sick of break-ins that weren't investigated, bullies on my boys' school bus, new and LOUD 'neighbors' who destroyed their (AND my) property during drunken brawls, roaming packs of youth who were looking for trouble day to night, etc.
If B-N would DO SOMETHING MORE about the 'new crime' (of the past five to seven years), I would be back "home" in a flash.
Maybe not, though. I've grown to LOVE Clinton's relative peace and quiet; it's a lot like B-N used to be, before the 'change'. I still lock my doors at night, but have experienced NOT ONE incident where I've had to call police to report a crime in the years I've been here. "

jipsi wrote on Sep 29, 2008 11:35 PM:

" Dymz, you wrote: "The police have a hard enough time filtering out the good leads from the bad leads without people turning in their neighbors because they happen to match a vague description of possible suspects."

If you read my posts, you would know this is PRECISELY why a DETAILED DESCRIPTION is needed, and invaluable when available. With so many witnesses, such would be possible. There would be no "vague" description; there would be a narrowing down of "possible suspects" to a 'handful'.
If twenty people get pulled over and questioned because they fit, for the most part, a DETAILED description, then just be cooperative and, if you're innocent of any crime or involvement with said incident, you'll be on your way in no time. EASY.
Only those with something to hide would find a problem with this. And for those, I feel not a smidge of compassion.
LESS people will be calling in with "possible" matches if they have a DETAILED description; it's the PC-generic ones, "teens to twenty somethings", that would, in fact, generate MORE erroneous call ins! "

pupndax4 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 8:13 PM:

" This makes me very angry..! Im so thankful that no one got seriously hurt. Not only is this a bar that I go to often, but the employee's their are not only family but long life friends. I have faith that the police will find the men who were behind this, and justice will be served. "

Realist wrote on Sep 29, 2008 5:35 PM:

" This is the most ridiculous thing I've read, along with 1/2 the comments. If someone commits a crime, give a description of them. We have armed thugs on the loose and no idea what they look like. And for those who think racial profiling is a problem, get over it. If you're not doing anything wrong, you don't have anything to worry about, period! What a joke. "

ConcernedBNCitizen wrote on Sep 29, 2008 4:31 PM:

" I am so tired of the scum living in these apartment complexes. Raise the rent and be selective about the tenants. The rest can go to Chicago or some hole for all I care. People can make the right choices and make a living in this country if they choose too.........regardless of the current economic problems. "

bloomington girl wrote on Sep 29, 2008 4:06 PM:

" pizzaman-I agree 100%-A lot of people are still in denial that people DO get pulled over, harrased, wrongfully ID'd just becuase of the color of their skin. "

bloomington girl wrote on Sep 29, 2008 4:00 PM:

" How many times does it need to be said that 50% of the population in jail is black??!! What am I really supposed to do with that information? How is anybody supposed to get over the "Race" card when every time there is a crime (that hasnt even released the desriptions yet) somebody has to throw the fact out that 'well 50% of the jail population is black" OKAY WE GET IT...Now how about a solution? Anybody? The problems we face in america are not only in black community!! We can't worry about what the nationwide statistics are when we can't even fix the problems here at home!!! And guess what? KNOWING that 50% of the jail pop. is black doesnt change a thing for me. I don't walk down the street and run the other way when a black person is coming near me and I feel real sorry for you who choose to do that.... "

mrdippy wrote on Sep 29, 2008 3:44 PM:

" Bad title for the article. It was a robbery, there is no doubt for me as I was there when it happened. Crazy times we live in... I hope they are caught. As someone there I will speculate that their motives for the theft were not honorable, probably illegal, and were without compassion. These are not people we want on the streets, based on my short experience being there during the robbery these men would not hesitate to break laws in the future. "

Nikki wrote on Sep 29, 2008 2:50 PM:

" I just wanted to say I'm sorry to hear about the robbery and to everyone at the Jammer that night. "

patriot5 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 2:47 PM:

" Oh how sad pizza man, once again the race card. First of all sure there are people prejudice in the world, and guess what they don’t always happen to be white. However your comment that if your black you will be pulled over is just another way for you to spread hatred, and blame your faults on your skin color instead of your inability to get over your own faults in life. On any given night there is only 8-9 officers that patrol the street, and about 10 on the weekend. If your scenario was true then all that would be done in Bloomington by the Police is traffic stops. Also being questioned by the police doesn’t constitute harassment. Why would a white male be pulled over if the description was black male, makes no sense and neither do you. NOBODY blames all black or white people when a crime is committed by a certain race "

floyd wrote on Sep 29, 2008 2:02 PM:

" Free beer at the Windjammer for the guy who popped the guy last week that tried to break in the apartment building in Bloomington! That'll take care of it! "

woo wrote on Sep 29, 2008 1:58 PM:

" HEY PIZZAMAN, JIPSI CLEARLY STATED HE DID'NT CARE WHAT COLOR THEY WERE AND I HAVE TO AGREE WITH HIM ON THIS. IM WHITE AND IF THEY ARE WHITE WE SHOULD KNOW THIS SO WE CAN MAYBE BE A LITTLE SAFER. NO WE CANT JUST STOP EVERYONE WHO LIVES CLOSE OR IS VISITING SOMEONE IN THE AREA BUT IF A BETTER DECRIPTION WOULD HELP CATCH THIS PEOPLE WOULD'NT YOU WANT THEM CAUGHT BEFORE THEY HURT ANYONE ELSE OR WORSE YET KILL SOMEONE NEXT? THEY COULD OF KILLED SOMEONE THIS TIME. THEY FIRED A HAND GUN IN THE BAR. LIKE HE SAID IT DOES'NT MATTER WHAT COLOR THEY ARE BUT LET PEOPLE KNOW. ITS NOT RACEST TO WANT TO KNOW THE COLOR AND I THINK MOST WOULD WANT TO KNOW THIS. I DONT THINK HE SAID ANYTHING RACEST. MANY PEOPLE DO SAY WHAT COULD BE TOOK AS RACEST ON HERE BUT I DONT THINK THAT IS WHAT HE WAS TRYING TO DO AT ALL. "

JohnDW wrote on Sep 29, 2008 1:40 PM:

" Maybe I'm wrong, yet if crime statistics of Black America are any indication-- I must say I am tired, really tired of African Americans crying foul in regards to racial profiling, and any other race card they are willing to play. To hard-working folks of any color-- Do you live or take time to dwell in primarily black areas of town? If so can you honestly tell me there isn't serious issues and social dilemmas in that community. Wake up and quit political correctness! Over 50% of murders, felonies, armed robberies, and violent juvenile crime in this country is committed by Blacks, which are only 13% of the population(SCARY). Pizzaman, wake up to the problem in Black Communities and nationwide: to crime, lack of responsibilities, drug addictions, uneducated parents, and all around poverty of African Americans in America.... plus, don't give me lack of effort or chances by Americans to assist Blacks because there are PLENTY of social programs on the books for such things. Take responsibility and place the blame from within!!!!! Hard work and confidence goes far, but if a certain percentage of America choose to complain and expect than growth in that community will not occur...... Progress!!!! "

Inaperfectworld wrote on Sep 29, 2008 1:23 PM:

" I totally agree with you DYMZ. Let the police do their job. I highly doubt that Jipsi needs a "detailed discription" of every criminal in Bloomington. By the time she drives to Bloomington from Clinton, "these thugs at large" could have time to alter that description and she wouldn't recognize them anyway. "

Dymz wrote on Sep 29, 2008 12:54 PM:

" Why would anyone that wasn't involved in the incident care about a description of these individuals? White/black/latino/a friggen alien...unless you were at the scene or in the area at the time of the crime, it really doesn't have any meaning. I don't think the police should give any general descriptions of individuals involved in crimes. The police have a hard enough time filtering out the good leads from the bad leads without people turning in their neighbors because they happen to match a vague description of possible suspects. Anyone remember the DC area sniper shootings a few years back? Lone sniper? Driving a "white box truck"? Even the cops/FBI had it wrong back then. Descriptions don't mean a thing and they can even lead an investigation down the wrong path. "

4mama wrote on Sep 29, 2008 12:50 PM:

" Pizzaman, I totally agree that racial profiling sucks, and that it is horrible to be stopped for no reason just because of the color of your skin. Having said that I must agree that an accurate description of the thugs is the first thing I looked for in the article, and I never found it. They could have had green hair, purple skin, be 7 feet tall and wearing a ballerina's tutu and they would have fit the descriptions given here. These guys sound like they are very dangerous having fired a shot and assualted people in the process of committing armed robbery. Any help to identify them should be the first priority, and I apologize to all who may also fit the description who were stopped, searched, and let go. Better to err on the side of conservatism on this one. "

jonjon wrote on Sep 29, 2008 12:42 PM:

" This is sad. I go there all the time and know many of the employees. I am just glad nobody was seriously hurt or killed. "

Barney Fife wrote on Sep 29, 2008 12:35 PM:

" to: mikeman...Satelite police stations only work if the victim wants to come in and file a report. Are you going to tell the people from Windjammer they should have to go to a building to file a report? Normal has not staffed their's for years. Keep the officers on patrol so they can respond faster. "

patriot5 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 12:35 PM:

" Pantagraph, what gives, you wont post any of my comments when I talk about people fueling racial hatred, but you will post those comments of people pushing the hatred, how very sad.......... "

STLCards5 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 12:27 PM:

" Pizzaman, I have been pulled over and my car searched when the cops were looking for a white male fugitive. Do you know what I did? I complied with what they asked and I was on my way when they were finished. It's a small price to pay by a law abiding citizen who expects the police to do their job. "

muttonhead31 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 12:03 PM:

" I agree with jipsi. An accurate description would help. The article excluded no one in their late teens or early 20's "

sgtppr67 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 11:05 AM:

" Pizzaman, i thank you for your comments. But you seem to use to much logic and reason for most of the people in our community. They think that if a skin color is mentioned that they will be able to nab up all of the perps in an instant. I think most of them would just love to break out their torches and pitchforks and chase down anyone who happens to walk by. "

pizzaman wrote on Sep 29, 2008 10:28 AM:

" jipsi, Have you ever been harrassed just because you were at the wrong place at the wrong time. Witness desrcipitions are still unreliable. So whatyou mean is that every minority who looked between the ages of 16 to 29 should have been stoped last night!!!!! What about the kid(who hasn't committed a crime besides driving while black,hispanic, or middle eastern) who just dropped there friend off who lives in the Arbors, should he be harrassed. Walk A mile in someone elses shoes before you post such idiotic comments. I have never enjoyed being stopped and hassled by the cops. I pay my taxes and do not cause any problems, but because I could have driven to that side of town at that particular time, I should be be happy to give up my rights as a citizen to help the police make you feel safer!!!! Put on some black face paint and drive your nice car into the west side or into Normal around 11:00 pm and see if your not stopped. Now do this every day for the rest of your life and you will see why racial-profiling only works for those who aren't victims of it!!!! "

Voice of Reason2 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 9:55 AM:

" If we had a concealed carry law those punks would be in the morgue instead of hitting people with rifle butts. "

jipsi wrote on Sep 29, 2008 9:40 AM:

" (3, cont from 2)
You know what? People ALREADY look askance at different races that have "somehow" wound up being stereotyped as "maybe criminal", and usually for logical reasons: blacks/AA (because of their high involvement in criminal activities, duh; Middle Eastern (because of the whole terrorism thing, right?), Asian (they're all geniuses, of course), Mexicans (they don't speak English, see), or whites/Caucasions (rich, racist and nervous, I know)... and it doesn't make it right, but these things are THERE and we have to try to deal with them as we go.
It's as if we're in a FAMILY, and because one sibling's hurt and angry and causing a fuss, Mom and Dad have decided to punish ALL OF US, so as not to appear like they're ganging up on the problem child.
This is WRONG on so many levels... I'll just stop now. "

jipsi wrote on Sep 29, 2008 9:40 AM:

" (2, cont from 1)
HIDING facts is racism at heart because it implies someone is already 'worrying' about race issues.

I don't want 'race issues' and hypersensitivity clouding the truth: I want DESCRIPTIONS and public information to be THOROUGH and FACTUAL so we, as citizens, can at least keep an eye out, report suspicious activity (or, God forbid, actually SPOTTING one of the robbers, RECOGNIZING them from the DETAILED DESCRIPTION, and calling it in?!).

If I go to any business NEAR WindJammer, now, I might be putting myself in danger by not knowing I'm in line with a suspect right behind me! Armed with a DETAILED DESCRIPTION, I'd be able to leave safely and call police, possibly saving myself AND others from the 'next' potential robbery'/attack!
(2, cont to 3) "

jipsi wrote on Sep 29, 2008 9:37 AM:

" So, because SOME PEOPLE are so PC they'll read 'racism' into EVERYTHING, there won't be a DETAILED DESCRIPTION??
These thugs are AT LARGE, and could enter any of a dozen other establishments, up and down the street in this area, and FREELY, because no one's going to be able to spot them and call in a sighting, are they, with a "description' as vague as "late teens to early 20's".
There were victims, witnesses... THEY have to be talking to others, so the race, hair and eye color, clothing worn, height, etc. are NO SECRET...
I don't care if they're white, black, brown or red, they ARE some version of 'color' and that IS a huge part of a description.
Knowing they've been sighted and described, that people are WATCHING out for them, might make these thugs think twice next time (no robbery also means NO ONE GETS HURT, as in the Windjammer incident).

If the STATS are getting to be such that things 'look bad' for one race or neighborhood over another, then TOUGH: CLEAN UP YOUR ACT and do a BETTER JOB of 'representing' your community!
(cont to 2) "

8271 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 9:36 AM:

" Can someone say "Vigilante". I'm sick of the crime and these people have no value what so ever. If the police can't stop the crime, why don't we! "

michelle24 wrote on Sep 29, 2008 8:44 AM:

" Mikeman is so right. I know a time or two ago the swat team was at the Arbors. A police station is totally needed in that area! "

Rolling Eyes wrote on Sep 29, 2008 8:11 AM:

" Wings, Etc., Jim's, now Windjammer. They all seem to be walking distance from a certain apartment complex near Washington and Prospect. "

mikeman wrote on Sep 29, 2008 6:30 AM:

" The city of Bloomington should operate a satelite police station near the Arbors apartment complex, the same way the city of Normal operates a satelite police station near the Orlando apartment complex. Was there not a recent robbery at Rosati's pizza that was tied to Arbors? Was there a recent break-in at Jim's Steakhouse which is across the street from Arbors? We the people who live in the area should attend the next city council meeting. "

Ads by Yahoo!

brighter skin la

Wall Street Rescue Plan

Beauty Skin Care